Game Boys for Play Girls! games & gender by Babsi

25 Aug 2006 Category: Features, Japan, Technology, Top Page 10, Worldwide

Barbara ‘Babsi’ Lippe enjoyed a typical postmodern childhood filled with cartoons, action figures, comics and video-games. The latter in particular had a great impact on her life: she has just finished a 1000 page PhD thesis about Games and Gender! PingMag interviewed the cheerful Austrian expert about why Japanese game esthetics are more appealing to women in the West and how the market in Europe is slowly changing.

Interview by Uleshka and Jon

Babsi, you just earned yourself a Dr. title for your “Game Boys for Play Girls” PhD thesis and currently work as a lead artist at the computer-game company Avaloop. What have the reactions been so far to your research?

I was surprised that so many people seem to be interested in the connection of gender -> games -> Japan. It seems like no Western research has really taken into account the Japanese game-scene so far, which is a shame since the whole console market has been in Japanese hands since the 1980s. All the Western children growing up with Super Mario and Sonic have been Japanized in a very enjoyable and sublime way.

Could you quickly point out the main differences between the Japanese game market and the European, Western one?

Until now Europeans have traditionally played a lot of PC games as opposed to console-based video-games. However the PC game market is declining. Like Japanese gamers, Europeans like RPGs (role-playing games) but they tend to favor PC RPGs to console RPGs. Americans, in general, tend to favor sports and action games.

A comparison between preferences of whole countries or even continents is difficult as there are so many games, even whole genres out there e.g. in Japan which will never hit Western shelves.

What sort of games are very typically Japanese, or non-Western, then?

In the West there simply are no ren’ai games, almost no games based on sound, no “ohanashi” games like Dokodemo Issho and the variety of arcade games is quite low compared to Japan.

This does not mean that westerners are not interested in these games. Which games are localised for a Western market is in the hands of marketing people, not gamers unfortunately. Black imports show that many gamers are not satisfied with the official supply.

Would you say that the image of games in Japan is generally a much more positive one?

Yes, not exclusively positive, but there are video-game cafés, ballets based on videogame music and courses for seniors who want to practice playing video-games - unlike in the West.

I would say that Western games are more realistic and more serious. Japanese games are more physical, more fun, more family-friendly and more humorous.

Developing video-games often goes hand in hand with showing off the latest 3D computer graphics. What do you think about this hyper-realism versus stylized art in games?

There is a controversy going on in Japan: photo vs. non-photo. This means: should games imitate reality in order to be more immersive? Or should they intentionally NOT be realistic in order to enable the player to establish an empathic relationship with the fantastic creatures the player controls?

As Aonuma-san of Nintendo had stated regarding the world in the Legend of Zelda: realism does not equal reality. A game-world has to feel coherent and real, but not necessarily look real.

Japanese artists do not force new possibilities of CG onto their games when they do not fit. A deliberately stylised game such as Loco Roco will look fresh also after years whereas interactive tech demos like Halo will look old-fashioned as soon as the technological standards of CG have risen again.

So what is it about games and girls, then? Why do you think that the Japanese market is so far ahead in terms of women’s games?

I don’t know about being “so far ahead”. Many Japanese games are definitely more girl-friendly, but still there are many games exclusively built for a male interest group.

However, females in Japan have been identified as a distinctive market. Like with magazines, TV-shows and manga, there are distinctive games for girls. Games like Super Princess Peach or Cooking Mama are targeted to a more mainstream female market. Also the trading card/arcade media-mix game Osharemajo Love and Berry by Sega is a relatively recent development for Japanese girls.

For me it was interesting to analyse why it is especially Japanese games like Katamari Damacy or Nintendogs that have such a striking appeal to Western females despite the fact they are not specially marketed to girls either.

It might be the emphasis on storyline in many Japanese games, the more artistic grade of graphical abstraction, the lack of repetitive violence - girls are not against violence, but against pointless repetition and boredom - and the existence of strong female characters that make many Japanese games more appealing than the American mainstream.

It is fascinating that cultural texts deriving from a totally different society can have such a universal appeal. I think this is because Japanese game designers seem to approach the game making process from a more human and emotional perspective.

Newer Japanese games like Electroplankton or Nintendogs are games that do not force the player to be competitive. They are open-ended, playful interactions. They are not inherently thrilling - they can even be relaxing. Non-competitive videogames are a novelty in the West and I think many players are becoming tired of the rigid notion of direct competition, high-scores and zero-sum losers.

However, there can never be any generalisation: it is not possible to talk about THE Japanese, or THE girls or THE videogame. I think personal taste, mood, age etc are much more important factors for game preference than anything else.

Generally there is a lack of females in the Japanese game industry as well, however, there are indeed some appreciated female creators:
Ozawa Junko (composer at Namco)
Kajishima Masaki (character designer for “Momo, the PostPet”, SCE)
Shinozaki Kaori (character designer for “Mr.Driller”, Namco)
Maita Aki (inventor of the “Tamagotchi”, Bandai)
Matsuura Kiri (co-operated on “Parappa the Rapper”, Nana-On-Sha)
Fukuyama Atsuko (animator for “Shadow of the Colossus”, SCE)
Nakamura Atsuko (develops “Kirby” games at HAL Laboratory, Inc.)…

A famous example of otomege (games for and by women) is also “Dinastia”, a MMORPG created by the famous female manga-ka Momoki Maimi, boasting the female gamer percentage to 75% (the game currently has around 9000 players and it is said that mothers play with their daughters). It should also not be forgotten that 90% of Tokyo’s character designers are female, such as Shimizu Ikuko, who invented “Hello Kitty” (Sanrio) in 1974.

These names may serve as wonderful examples of powerful females who influenced the very popular culture we all live in.

Why do you think women are often excluded as an audience for games in Europe and the US?

Videogames derive from a totally male coded culture - computer technology. This is also reflected in the way they are produced. Males create games for males in an environment that often is still very hostile to anyone who does prioritise family time over working time.

As long as technology is ideologically linked to the expertise of males there will be a certain obstacle for other gaming demographics like females and older people. Games like SingStar, Dance Dance Revolution and Brain Age as well as consoles like the Nintendo DS and Nintendo Wii do change this image. The more girls enter gaming as a hobby at an early age the more likely it is that females will become the producers of the future in an industry which is until now male dominated.

What IS happening in Europe at the moment? To what extent has the game industry changed?

Smaller companies are growing, huge companies are collapsing, and many new start ups are hitting the scene. Of course there is still a lack of acceptance of the videogame as a cultural resource when it comes to governmental support, covering in the traditional mass media, and many universities, but that is slowly changing.

There is not nearly as much happening as in Japan but I think the whole situation is improving. Especially with the rise of independent games and the possibilities of digital distribution which render smaller development studios autonomous from rigid, market-driven, corporate decisions. The award-winning game Darwinia by the British indie-developer Introversion Software is a great example of this new wind that is blowing.

Do you think that you as a women are attracted to games in a different way that men would be?

If I was a guy I would like games for the same reason as I do now: the possibility to be the author of something. As a player you create a whole new world, story, situation. A whole universe unfolds while your are playing and each game-session offers a distinctively new feeling.

I like the social aspect of multiplayer games and the drama in the adventures. I like the bittersweet near-addiction that lasts for a short while and in many games I just cannot get enough of the fabulous score or the breathtaking art.

Why do you think that portable game devices like Nintendo DS or PSP are more appealing to women than the usual console or PC?

Firstly, the tiny, shiny Nintendo DS, Nintendo Advance SP, Game Boy Micro and PSP look sexy. They are lifestyle products. They are great accessories in a lady’s designer handbag.

A reason why females are subsumed under the category “casual, portable gamers” is also due to their tight time-budget. They move towards games that are quick and easy-to-play for in-between situations. Would you like to start watching a 3-hour movie, listening to an opera or reading an enormous, romantic novel when you know that in 10 mintes you have to feed your baby, your husband comes home and wants dinner and your curious auntie calls every 30 minutes anyway? Games (like any other medium) are tools for mood management.

Why do you think that the Japanese cuteness gets accepted in the West, where being cute can sometimes be an “insult” for a woman?

Because it is exotic. Because Japan is cool at the moment. Just an observation: recently I met a very fashionable guy in Sweden. He was wearing a black Northface parka with a Kitty-chan reflector attached on his hoodie.

However, many Westerners equal cuteness with kitsch and childishness. I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior. So there is almost no character business for adults in the West, and there is rarely a mascot used instead of a logotype.

What do you wish to happen for the game industry in the future?

I am very, very positive. With the new home-console Nintendo Wii a truly new generation of games will enter our lives. Developers all over the world are looking forward to creating games for this new console as it enables them to invent and realise totally new gameplay ideas. During the last few years Microsoft has opened the doors to mainstream, console-based on-line gaming with its Xbox Live! service, Sony has shown great innovations with its EyeToy and SingStar technology and as a platform for internationally released Japanese game-artworks like Rez, Katamari Damashii, ICO and Shadow of the Colossus.

However, I believe that the Nintendo Wii will be the winner in the race of innovative games on the consoles of the next generation. Games will be even more intuitive, fun and interactive. The way humans communicate and interact with machines will be more natural, more friendly. Whereas nowadays Korea leads in terms of networked gaming and the West in terms of graphic technology, it is Japan that has always excelled in game design ideas and innovations concerning the relation between player -> game -> toy.

The professional profile of a game developer will (and has to) change very much in my opinion. Technological knowledge is of great importance but cultural and social understanding are equally as important. Because in the end: Games are culture.

Along with Henry Jenkins from MIT I claim: the videogame is just about to become the most important cultural expression of the 21st century.

Babsi is currently discussing the making of her book with several publishers. We will keep you updated once it is out. If there is anything you want to ask her - feel free to let it out in the comments!

130 Comments

1. A very interesting read!

   I have a question about this part near the end:

   “I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior.”

   Is this taken up further in the thesis? While not directly related to gaming I find it an interesting idea.

   Hope the book deal goes through.

   Posted by: Kim on August 25th, 2006 at 11:48 pm

2. Very cool article. There is a lot of talk about girls and gaming these days, but not much ‘real’ study that I’ve seen. Babsi and Mimi Ito are the exception (although, please add any more links to this comment thread!).

   I’ve noticed a lot more girls playing MMORPG’s than the more ‘quick hit’ style games seen on consoles - is this a recognised trend or am I isolated? We have more girls in our (admittedly small) Warcraft guild than guys…

   Posted by: Pete Barr-Watson on August 26th, 2006 at 12:47 am

3. Well done, Babsi! U rock.

   Posted by: badoli on August 26th, 2006 at 2:32 am

4. very nice read. even if the japan hype should be temporal, western game designers can learn a lot from japan.

   Posted by: scr on August 26th, 2006 at 5:16 am

5. It seems that games such as WOW might appeal to girls because they encourage the creation, nurturing, socializing and development of a character. Yet World of Warcraft seems to be targeted less to women, and more towards male gamers. Take for example Ragnarok Online (from Korea) - this game is similar to WOW in gameplay, but seems to be targeted less directly at either gender. There are wonderful elements of character customization present on Ragnarok (which would be even better if the graphics were more detailed) that seem to be a bit lacking in WOW. Ragnarok seems to have groups of people hanging out & chatting all over the place because of the built-in chat/social function - If Blizzard were to add functionality with the female target audience in mind, they’d be opening up a huge market. Though this is not to say they don’t already have a large number of women playing (my wife is an avid WOW fan!)

   Posted by: Spyhunter on August 26th, 2006 at 6:37 am

6. By the way, that HL2 render is a fan made creation, perhaps the copyright should point towards it’s creator instead.

   http://www.nickbertke.com

   Posted by: Pat on August 26th, 2006 at 12:23 pm

7. [...] My good friend, <a href=”http://www.lippe.at/>Dr Babsi</a> is <a href=”http://www.pingmag.jp/2006/08/25/game-boys-for-play-girls-games-and-gender-by-babsi/”>on teh interwebs again. [...]

   Posted by: Game Boys for Play Girls! « Gareth R White on August 26th, 2006 at 9:16 pm

8. Great interview, probably the best of Babsi’s that I’ve read.

   Keep us informed about when the book’s available. I still couldn’t find the thesis in the Österreichische Nationalbibliothek and I’d really like to read that work for my MA.

   Posted by: Gareth R White on August 26th, 2006 at 9:23 pm

9. great article.
   this girl rules.
   I <3 nintendo

   Posted by: aw3qc on August 27th, 2006 at 6:19 am

10. Very good article, but I STRONGLY disagree with the idea that small developers are becoming less significant. While there will always be small developers, and some of them wlil even get breakout hits, or find decent followings, things are becoming very expensive.

    Its harder with the new consoles to make games that utilize the hardware well, and that come across as competitors to other games in the marketplcae. This is both due to the development costs, and due to the extreme costs of accessing distribution beyond the internet (which are, by the way, how most games are sold in western countries).

    The author notes that games are headed for console. this makes this even worse. The costs for getting on a console in terms of acceptance tests and the developer kits are prohibative for a small developer.

    Perhaps a day will come when content is all you need and you just slap it onto an engine, but that day has not come, and it is not happening in the near-future.

    Posted by: Tom on August 27th, 2006 at 7:19 am

11. EDIT — Small developers are becoming LESS significant, not MORE significant

    typo in my original post

    Posted by: Tom on August 27th, 2006 at 7:20 am

12. I’m not so sure Tom - I think indie video game development is going through an interesting stage right now, partly because it’s becoming that bit easier to distribute games online in a way that can bring in money - see Steam, or how Geometry Wars first started out.

    Sure, it’s never going to be like Codemasters back in the 80’s, but there will always be ways for indie developers to be seen and heard. What about the Long Tail theory too, eh? ;)

    Posted by: Tim on August 27th, 2006 at 11:32 am

13. The long tail theory is basically that when people can get information about less mainstream stuff, AND buy it due to improvements in operations through centralization, that the potential products on the market goes way up.

    This only works if the products are considered acceptable substitutes for the “mainstream” products. You see a LOT more long tail in music and books than in video beacuse B movies just dont look that good — money is required to make them good enough to be something people want to watch.

    On the other hand, an unknown band or unknown author can easily be really good. The cost of making top quality music or a book is fairy low.

    Posted by: Tom on August 27th, 2006 at 5:37 pm

14. Sorry to finish my point — video games are closer to movies in this regard. People are comparing them to AAA games and then feel disappointed before they even play, unlike a book which can get a good cover if you pay a decen artist $1000.

    Posted by: Tom on August 27th, 2006 at 5:38 pm

15. Very many thanks for a good work. Nice and useful. Like it!

    Posted by: Jeorge Lukasing on August 27th, 2006 at 7:00 pm

16. Essentially this is the work of someone who simply has a bias toward a certain kind of gaming, namely the “quirky” Japanese style, and has let this influence her perception of all other kinds of games.

    There are a lot of horribly ill-conceived stereotypes at work here, and I wanted to take this opportunity to call Babsi out of a few of them:

    “I would say that Western games are more realistic and more serious. Japanese games are more physical, more fun, more family-friendly and more humorous.”

    This is a completely absurd statement. Both western and eastern games run the full spectrum of all these traits.

    Now I first want to point the transparent bias exemplified by claiming that “fun” is a stonger value in Japanese games. As if ANYONE plays games that they don’t consider fun! At best this shows a self-centered notion of what constitutes “fun.”

    Take for example the ever-popular Grand Theft Auto series, which are famous for their dark sense of humor (though I get the feeling that Babsi here probably hasn’t played the game for 10 minutes to realize this). Compare this to the relatively deadpan Japanese equivalent, Yakuza.

    One should also consider very successful lighthearted western games in like Jak and Daxter, Rayman, Earthworm Jim, Toejam and Earl, Sam and Max…

    Also, many of Japan’s most popular franchises are quite “serious.” The Final Fantasy games are known for melodrama and angsty, tortured characters. Metal Gear, too, is a quite dark drama centered on the threat of nuclear attack. Japan’s most prolific RPG series, Megami Tensei, is a very bleak series centered on themes of nihilism and moral ambiguity in a post-nuclear Japan. Both Eastern and Western games have many, many successful games that are both humorous and serious.

    And the gall to claim Japanese games are more physical?! The Japanese gaming market features much more turn-based gaming! Western RPGs almost never have turn-based systems, where Japanese games often do. Similarly strategy games in the West are more often of the real-time variety, where in Japan they are almost entirely turn-based.

    I won’t extesively debate the family-friendly thing, but I would like to point out the irony that Japanese games are very frequently

    “Newer Japanese games like Electroplankton or Nintendogs are games that do not force the player to be competitive. They are open-ended, playful interactions. They are not inherently thrilling - they can even be relaxing. Non-competitive videogames are a novelty in the West and I think many players are becoming tired of the rigid notion of direct competition, high-scores and zero-sum losers.”

    I’d just like to point out that the best selling game of all time in the West is, in fact, an open-ended, non-competitive game by the name of The Sims.

    “girls are not against violence, but against pointless repetition and boredom“

    Jesus Christ, do I even need to address this kind of childishness? I get it, we’re rotten, made out of cotton.

    Posted by: Travis Fahs on August 27th, 2006 at 11:55 pm

17. Oh, I meant to point out that perhaps the reason for Babsi’s hang up regarding humor and playfulness is the different kinds of humor in Japan vs the West, not the presence or absence thereof.

    I think that it’s correct that Japanese humor tends to be more visual. Even when delivered in dialogue, it is generally paired with over-the-top facial expressions. Slapstick and sight gags abound. There’s a great deal of absurdist humor, which is also present in the West.

    Western humor, particularly among the British and the Americans, tends more often to be dryer. Dark humor, sarcasm, and ironic humor are far more prevalent, where these things barely exist in Japan.

    Interestingly, I find that French games often tend to have their own mode of humor which I find to be more similar to the Japanese than to the American or British.

    It might also be the case that the type of humor I described as uniquely Western might also be more dominantly male. For example, in New York City, where stand-up comedy is known for being its darkest, there are relatively few successful female comics (though there are certainly a few, and they can be quite dark, too), and comedy patronage is also very dominantly male.

    I have heard some conjecture that women are naturally more empathetic, and thus don’t like humor with a mean bite to it, but I really think it’s probably more of a cultural thing than anything else.

    Posted by: Travis Fahs on August 28th, 2006 at 12:10 am

18. I am a chick and I totally get it, thanks for a great interview! Now I understand why a 41 year old working mom could love to play Animal Crossings: Wild World by herself as much as she loves to play it with her daughter.

    Posted by: kim reist on August 28th, 2006 at 11:41 pm

19. very very interesting article! i’m about to find out a topic for my m.a. work (in cultural sciences), thinking and thinking about something that has to do with japan-hope the article is gonna help me!

    tsuishin @ barbara lippe: may I ask you your studies at university?
    thanks a lot for your answer!

    Posted by: anne on August 29th, 2006 at 3:54 am

20. She’s holding a Dreamcast controller on that one photo which states ‘Engrossed in an N64 game’, not a N64 one.

    Other than that, nice article. I will definitely give it a read once it comes out as a book!

    Posted by: eight on August 29th, 2006 at 6:04 pm

21. The “light-hearted” Western games you mention are nothing like games in Japan. Daxter, Earthworm Jim, etc. are all traditional platformers, despite a goofy air. Her point is that Japan produces more games where the goal is just to have fun in various ways, with no goal of beating someone else or getting a high score. No games remotely similar to Roco Loco, Katamari, or Nintendogs are produced in the West. She is obviously biased, but American games do tend to be more focused on action and competition.

    Your descriptions of all the serious FF-type games only support her statement that Japanese games are more focused on character development and detailed story. She does confuse her argument by mentioning games without plot and then saying that Japanese games have stronger plot and characters. There are plot-based RPGs, and then completely plotless fun games like Katamari in Japan, and the fact that those are the two popular genres in Japan says a lot about cultural differences and game development.

    All the counter-examples you can find of Western games with good stories or innovative gameplay don’t change the fact that RPGs and innovative, cute, and purely fun games are popular in the mainstream in Japan. All of those games are only cult classics in America. It is true that the Sims is popular in America, but I think that that one series is still different from the wide variety of Japanese games. Games like Halo and sports games are massively popular in America, rather than games of the type she is talking about.

    Finally, by saying that games are more physical, I believe she is refering to games like Dance Dance Revolution, Guitar Hero, and the Taiko Drum playing arcade game. You have to jump around and be active, not just sit there. As far as I know, no games like this are produced in America.

    American and Japanese games are each good in their own ways, and some people prefer one or the other. She obviously prefers Japanese games and even degrades “boring, repitious” American games, but you can’t deny that there are great differences in the games that are produced and enjoyed in each country overall.

    Also, nice article.

    Posted by: Waru on August 30th, 2006 at 7:44 am

22. The “light-hearted” Western games you mention are nothing like games in Japan. Daxter, Earthworm Jim, etc. are all traditional platformers, despite a goofy air.

    But they are goofy and humorous. She specifically said that Western games tend not to use humor and japanese games are more humorous. I was merely addressing one of the many things she lumped together.

    Her point is that Japan produces more games where the goal is just to have fun in various ways, with no goal of beating someone else or getting a high score.

    If that was her point, then it’s misguided, uninformed, and completely incorrect. The “sim” genre originated in the West, and has always been more popular here. Open-ended gaming with no set goal or objective is, in fact, a signature of western game design, and far more rare in japan. Games like The Sims are very popular with girls, far more than Animal Crossing is. And there’s 100 other games like that I can think of.

    No games remotely similar to Roco Loco, Katamari, or Nintendogs are produced in the West.

    No games remotely similar to Katamari and Loco Roco are produced in the East, either. They’re simply rare originals. We have some of those, too, you know.

    Oh, and Katamari is a game with score-based objectives, and a competitive 2-player mode.

    Games like Halo and sports games are massively popular in America, rather than games of the type she is talking about.

    Halo is a game on a system that Japan sees as a threat to their own companies dominance of the console gaming market. It’s also a first-person action game, which the japanese hate, but Babsi never even breached that topic.

    Sports games, are very, very popular in japan. But they’re more into Soccer and Baseball than American Football, obviously. So that’s a silly point.

    She obviously prefers Japanese games and even degrades “boring, repitious” American games, but you can’t deny that there are great differences in the games that are produced and enjoyed in each country overall.

    Certainly, but my point was that Babsi, here, hasn’t the foggiest clue what these really are, and many of her notions are the oppostite of what’s actually representitive of game design philosophy.

    Japanese games tend to use a lot of bright, garrish colors considered tacky by westerners. Despite a few successes with games like Animal Crossing and Nintendogs, they prefer more linear, structured, and objective-based games, particularly in story-oriented genres like RPGs and action-adventures. They prefer turn-based and menu-based interactions in their adventure, strategy, and RPGs.

    Westerners prefer a more subdued visual style, more often. They like thier games to be wide-open ended, and any story objectives to be optional as in Oblivion and Grand Theft Auto. They enjoy first-person games, where Japan often does not. They like their RPGs and strategy games in real-time, without turn-based elements. They are more interested in the concept of a “Sandbox game” where the player is given a great deal of freedom to do as he pleases.

    Posted by: Travis Fahs on September 1st, 2006 at 12:13 am

23. Oh, and if girls were against pointless repitition and boredom, I don’t think they’d be walking around their town plucking weeds in Animal Crossing or petting at puppy with 3 interaction in Nintendogs. Those are some of the most repetitive games I’ve ever seen.

    Posted by: Travis Fahs on September 1st, 2006 at 12:18 am

24. “I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior.”

    I take it that you don’t speak Japanese?
    In a Japanese text, normally, around half the characters written are “kana” characters that represent sounds without having any ideographical meaning. And the kanji characters themselves are sometimes used as sounds as well. Japanese writing is WRITING, not some kind of drawing system.

    Posted by: Techslayer on September 2nd, 2006 at 4:42 am

25. I actually really like this article and found it very informative and also as other comments pointed out it’s nice to see someone taking the study of gender and games seriously we do need to know why games have failed with women and I also agree with her point that technology is unfortunately commonly seen as a male centric thing (although if you include medicine or web design that generalization becomes less exact). However, Love and Berry (which is used an example) is actually very competitive, it requires players to trade cards of various different rarities creating a competitive market which can get rather nasty if you’ve ever seen legions of school girls argueing over a paticularly rare dress card, and the video game is also a rythmic competition, but then again you could turn this around, perhaps they want that dress so they can match their partner and assist each other on the machines tapping the dance buttons in unison so they both win, I’m not sure how it always works. Anyway, was an interesting interview would love to read the book.

    p.s. I love repetitive hyper-compettive FPSes that involve killing people constantly in various different brutal ways so don’t do away with my hegemonic male american exercises quite yet please…

    Posted by: andrew jones on September 3rd, 2006 at 11:09 pm

26. oh yeah and the success of Princes Angelique seems to suggest girls can like violent games if the subject matter is right…

    uncomfortably Clavis like,
    A

    Posted by: andrew jones on September 3rd, 2006 at 11:29 pm

27. “I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior.”

    A very interesting thought actually. Pair this with an overall sense of elitism in the crafts and arts and you have a bias in Europe towards the “serious”. And by that I don’t necessarily mean “serious games”, but take for instance the general idea about cartoons or comic books being solely something for children, which is absurd (leave France out of this equation). Compare this to Japan and you have a whole other way of looking at childishness.

    If you think about it a bit, game development perhaps should start acting a bit like movie development, thereby generating fresh ideas every time a team gathers to create a game derived from a good idea, instead of having the same team making the same games over and over again…

    Posted by: Massimo Fiorentino on September 4th, 2006 at 3:34 pm

28. [...] A very interesting article and discussion over at PingMag about gender and games, European gaming versus Japanese. Worth the read. [...]

    Posted by: [°} » Blog Archive » Games and gender on September 4th, 2006 at 3:37 pm

29. [...] By the previous images one may get falsely the impression that a major female turn took place in the games industry - but in fact on the contrary - it was rather hard to find females at all at the GC and it was the first time in my life that I saw on a public event a line in front of the men toilets and not - as usual (architects listen!) a line in front of the women’s toilet. There is a very interesting interview with Barbara Lippe on ping mag about gender and games. (actually there are also other interesting points in that interview…especially the one about how reality looks like). A lot of interesting links on the gender issue and on games in general you may also find on Mary Flanagan’s website. [...]

    Posted by: randform » Blog Archive » Games Convention Part II on September 8th, 2006 at 7:22 pm

30. great article a very nice read.

    from my look on how travis fah writes about it. it seems fairly biased on a reversed side. one note. an M is not equals to an F and an F is not equal to an M. and for that i rest my case.

    Posted by: wootwoot791 on September 13th, 2006 at 5:58 pm

31. Mr. Travis Fahs makes some valid points, but it’s unfortunate that he resorts to the same bias (in his case, a bias for Western games) that he is criticizing. “Bright and garish colors” vs. “subdued” (Anyone can just as well say “subdued and dull colors”).

    “Halo is a game on a system that Japan sees as a threat to their own companies dominance of the console gaming market.” Not in Japan (or Asia for that matter). The XBox and XBox 360 are virtually invisible in this market.

    “Western humor, particularly among the British and the Americans, tends more often to be dryer. Dark humor, sarcasm, and ironic humor are far more prevalent, where these things barely exist in Japan.” I take it Mr. Fahs’s exposure to Japanese culture is primarily in the realm of videogames, manga, and anime? Non-over-the-top, dark and ironic humor (sarcasm is significantly Western) abound in Japanese theater, literature, and film, artforms much older and more historically developed than the aforementioned popular artforms.

    I will disagree about the nihilism in Megami Tensei games. They have touches of nihilism, but their philosophies aren’t necessarily centered around it.

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34. to give a girl’s pov.. i like japanese games b/c they have more “cute” characters.. whereas american games tend to have more realistic style.. i prefer cute over realisitc style. i find realism not as suprising. and characters in japanese games tend to be more expressive too which i like. ren’ai games are popular in japan b/c it’s in the same tradition as their popular shojo manga/anime. manga for girls.. they’re all consumed by the same demographics, girls. however thre are renai games for boys as well.

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    Posted by: Melissa on January 23rd, 2007 at 3:25 am

38. great article. i am not sure if i agree with everything, but it is definitely a good area to study.

    if anyone has any great links to articles on character design, east vs west on character design, etc…please send them my way.

    Posted by: nicool on February 8th, 2007 at 5:32 am

39. “I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior.”

    I agree. When I came to UK for my MA (in graphic design), it was my first observation about the culture here especially in academic context. I was looking at some Japanese design with my tutor, and he pointed out the use of illustrations / icons were not appropriate, it devalued the content and it should have been expressed in text. I did not agree then and still don’t agree having worked in London for a while.

    It is an interesting cultural difference. If I am designing for Japanese audience, I will use icons / pictograms. If I am designing for English speaking audience, I will limit the use of icons / pictograms to minimum.

    It is like: It is very hard to find a 40 something business man reading a comic book on public transport in London and it’s generally considered embarrassing. They are everywhere in Tokyo and it’s normal.

    Yes - as someone mentioned, we do NOT think it as a picture when we write, but when you encounter a piece of Kanji that you are not familiar with, you can guess the meaning by looking at its composition - like looking at a picture. This is a question for neurologist, but probably deep down, we maybe still seeing them as pictures…

    Thoughts on Western v Japanese games: I worked for some game related clients and they always emphasise that Japanese game market is wildly different from Western game market therefore games need to be marketed differently. I wonder what happens if we removed all the marketing layer…

    Posted by: sari on February 14th, 2007 at 4:50 am

40. I liked the article but agree that there’s some bias going on. To get a better idea what Babsi is saying I think we need to read the book as the interview seems like a very short insight to what she has to say on the matter.

    In terms of differences between Japanese and Western gamers, I think we will always have this due to differences in culture and up bringing. That’s not to say that the gap will always be as big as it is now. Due to success of games like Nintendogs and Elite Beat Agents Western gamers seem more open to the ‘quirky’ Japanese style of games. True it will never be a big contender against the popularity of FPS’s RTS’s Sports etc but still, the lines between Eastern and Western games are blurring all the time - a trend which is set to continue thanks to more intuitive control methods from the Nintendo DS and Wii.

    But also, Japanese developers are trying to recreate some more Western style games. Lost Planet and Dead Rising from Capcom have elements we see in Japanese games as well as Western games. Likewise, Kojima Productions were very interested Gears of War and the staff were all keen to play it/see what it has to offer. Gears of War itself managed to get some credibility with Japanese gamers due to well crafted dubbing and lip syncing in order to get the characters to speak Japanese.

    As long as we keep buying, games will keep being made. If we start to buy a lot more Japanese style games then more Japanese style games will make their way over here. At the end of the day, it all comes down to whether or not the game will make the company money in that specific territory. Lets just hope the boundaries continue to blur at the rate they are and we get a chance to try out all these ‘too quirky for westerners’ games for ourselves.

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43. Kim on August 25th, 2006 at 11:48 pm …
    “I think because the Western culture is a reading culture based on an abstract alphabet and not graphemes like Japanese kanji any information that is drawn instead of written is seen as inferior.”

    Is this taken up further in the thesis? While not directly related to gaming I find it an interesting idea.

    If you want to explore a fascinating analysis (by a brain surgeon) of how male/female brains process information differently, you might want to check out this book:

    _The Alphabet vs. The Goddess: the Conflict Between Word and Image” by Leonard Shlain

    That’s a little OT but seriously, the book blew my mind: how writing killed pictures, basically, but how the internet might be changing that.

    Not saying every word is true, but definitel some interesting facts n observations.

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44. Bias towards the games can’t be avoided. After all, we have different preferences over what games we want to play. But to say something without backing it up with valid evidence and/or experience will get this discussion to nowhere. I think it all comes down to one thing — cultural differences and the respect/tolerance of people about it.

    By the way, I hope that game developers in the future would create more and more mainstream games that are not gender-specific so that everyone can play it and have fun ^_^v

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45. I love what you have written, I live in South Africa and I love Japanese art, I can only say that the sheer cuteness of an anime styled girl is intoxicating.

    I never noticed a bias against girls playing games, on the contrary girls never seemed to want to play any games because they said ‘games are for children’ Thankfully that school of thought is changing.

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